‘Hacks’ showrunners explain how the show’s 17 Emmy nominations up the ante for season two

When Lucia Agniello, Paul W. Downs and Jen Statsky worked together wide city, the rewards were in their hands. “It wasn’t like that in our world,” says Downes, who expected the same thing before his latest collaboration, HBO Max. tricksIt earned 15 Emmy nominations (and three wins) in its first season. “It was shocking,” said Aniello, who is married to Downs. When the comedy series, which stars Jean Smart as Deborah Vance and Hannah Einbinder as millennial writer Ava, returned for a second season this spring, the writing trio felt pressured to deliver as well as the first season. “But none of us expected to get more nominations. [17 in total], and strangely managed to surprise us again,” adds Downes, who also plays Agent Smart in the series. As Downs and Aniello’s baby cooks in the background, the trio weighs up plot points, expectations and Smart’s passion for Christmas.

You built this show with a plan of what it would be like for several seasons, including the series finale. How close was season two to that vision?

paul w bass We knew they were on their way and that was a big part of the season. We obviously knew we were dealing with email [that Ava had sent maligning her boss], and we felt it was a revelation and character growth for Ava to just stand her ground and be honest. I think it was at the beginning of Blue Sky. [brainstorming session for season two] With that being said, Deborah left Ava at the end of this season. It was not in our initial field.

Lucia Aniello Our blue sky, which mainly occurs when we do the big picture [planning for the upcoming] season, that’s what we’re doing right at the end, when the finale just aired. It’s usually two weeks and then we take a little break before diving into the next season. So we do this because, first, it’s really new what we’ve just learned, and second, it means that during our little break that we have, we’ll be able to let these things sink in in our minds.

You also have real-time feedback to consider. How has the response to the first season influenced your approach to the second?

LOW I think because we were doing a tone that we hadn’t seen a lot on TV, it had comedic characters, we could be funny and make jokes, but also have a lot of heart and emotion. It’s because [worked in season one]we manage [do] Things that might seem broad on another show, like putting off a lesbian cruise, but also leaning into those heartfelt moments and doing things where this 60- and 70-year-old woman is starting from scratch and reliving all the abominations she’s suffered along the way. . We also learned about our cast, how fabulous Carl Clemons-Hopkins is, so we wanted to give them some really juicy stuff this year.

Aniello Hannah’s physical comedy is something we didn’t know when we were writing the first season because we hadn’t filmed it yet. He is a former competitive cheerleader and, as a result, has such incredible command of his body that he seamlessly transitions into a physical comedian. This is something that, for example, is more fun.

What was the response to the season finale, which some thought would be the perfect series finale?

Jen Statsky It was good in the sense that it meant people were emotionally satisfied with the resolution of that particular story, but for us, we expressed that in the way the show ends when we first showed it, and the balcony scene isn’t quite right. . The show ends. We have more stories to tell.

There was a sex scene this season with the characters of Gene Smart and Devon Sawa that felt like romance in a way I didn’t want it to be. But the 70-year-old actor’s intimate, sexual presence isn’t something viewers see often, and I wonder what kind of conversations surrounded that choice.

LOW We were well aware of the fact that this novel is about an older woman and a younger man. You don’t even consider the age difference when it’s a mayor and a younger woman because that’s what’s happening in the world, but it’s one of the things that we’re really happy with the program we’re showing this older woman. that she is sexy, fierce and loud, and enjoys her sexuality. And also for Jean to say, “Wow, I can do this. For example, I don’t have to wear a wig and look older than I am, which I do at a lot of shows.” I think one of the things that’s really exciting about her on the show is that she honestly looks the way she is, because there’s a lot of older lady cosplays that I think actresses should do if they’re that age. It’s like, “Okay, give me a cane, give me a wild wig and let me go and I’ll do a dramatic monologue.”

I know you had people like comedy writer Janis Hirsch as a consultant in season one. Who did you bring in season two?

Aniello We brought in Carol Leifer as one of our top consulting producers, and she will also be joining us for season three. The great thing about her is that she’s a woman who’s been around for a long time and has made a name for herself, but she’s still had to work at a boys’ club for so long, so she’s got some great stories to tell. I don’t know if I can say, but I will say that Susie Esman was someone who was part of our Blue Sky Room. We’ve known him for years. wide city, and also accompanied us in the third season’s blue sky. He has amazing stories and jokes, but he’s also so hyper-intellectual and psychologically aware that he’s portrayed stories and characters here as if he’s been a professional screenwriter for decades.

You brought parts of yourself and your actors into these stories. Can I remember any examples?

Aniello A lot of things we think we put in Ava’s mouth, especially things like, “Billionaires shouldn’t exist.” It’s our point of view what we’re doing directly, but it looks the same.

statsky As we get to know our actors, there are certainly things from Jean’s life or Hannah’s life. Like Deborah’s Christmas Room, which comes from Jean Smart, because she The love isChristmas

LOW In the first season we filmed with Santa Claus. She sits on his lap for a photo shoot and loves the giant nutcracker. He says, “Can I have this?” But it was rented. So Jen, Lucia and I decided to buy it for Christmas, and then Jen found a great match on Craigslist.

statsky They were probably like five- or six-foot-tall nutcrackers in their little guard shacks, and I had a lot of fun with them for Jean. So I send them an email and they say, “Sorry, someone bought this.”

LOW So we went to the prop house and said, “Can we buy this, please? Because Jean really loved it. They let us buy a nutcracker from the set which was really nice and we took it to Jean.

statsky As we pull into the driveway, I can hear Paul say, “Jen, Jen, my God, Jen, she bought a nutcracker. Jean was the man! (laughs.)

I imagine you’re under pressure to maintain the quality of this show, which critics and Emmy voters launched in its first season. How do you deal with that pressure and try to make sure you’re not stressed at the same time?

Aniello It changes constantly in terms of who feels the pressure and who says, “Hey, let’s have fun.”

statsky Yes, it depends on the day.

Aniello And who was the last to go to therapy? (laughs.)

statsky However, I will say that it probably will. (He puts his hands on his face.)

Aniello Obviously there’s pressure, but we’re doing our best and it’s a challenge not to think about external things. What makes us laugh must be our North Star, because it’s the only way to do it without weakening us completely. So we really try to block him out as much as we can, which is also a bad thing because you don’t always get the happy parts.

LOW Still, I will say that the impact of 17 Emmy nominations now for a show about an older woman and a younger queer woman, at a time when women’s rights and gay rights are under attack, was definitely promising. When we were going to release it, we thought, “Are people going to buy a show about a 70-year-old woman and her gay writer?” As much as we try not to draw attention to these things, there’s no way not to get excited about something like this in this climate.

The interview has been edited for length and clarity.

This story first appeared in the separate August issue of The Hollywood Reporter magazine.